Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 13:03:49 -0700 (MST) From: XXX@imap3.asu.edu To: JUDITH C CLAYTON <jvan@asu.edu> Subject: ENG 102 TTh 12:15

Prof. Van, I believe the source of my, as well as my classmates' frustrations is the ambiguity of our objectives. My main question is "Why?" are we doing the things that we do? Why are we working in groups if we write it all personally? Why did we look up sources for others when we don't get a copy of them? My other concern with the class is that I don't feel that you've taught us anything. You just say, ok, do it. We are all at a loss for what it is we are supposed to do. That is why we are all so frustrated. I've taken three English composition courses at Washington University in St. Louis (a much better school than this, if i may say) and i have never been a part of this type of class. It's not the computer that's different, it's the instruction. Despite what you may think, i am on your side just as you are on ours. I believe if you clearly lay out our objectives, why we do the things we do, that the class will come around and work with you instead of against you. We could all learn from this experience. We are actually here to learn. Without instruction, we feel that we are paying for nothing. Another cause of our frustration is the "busy work." I don't know if you look at the exercises but they tell us to "reflect, underline, or think about" things. That's fine but somehow you expect us to put that on paper and turn in our thoughts. That is something that, as a professor, you should know we can't do. I thank you for your patience with us and for listening to my frustrations. I'm sure we can figure this whole mess out if we give it a try.

XXX

Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 21:39:48 -0700 (MST) From: jvanasu@imap2.asu.edu To: XXX@imap3.asu.edu Subject: Re: ENG 102 TTh 12:15

Dear XXX, I appreciate the interest you take in your education. I will address some of your concerns in this post, and also in a post to the class.

On Tue, 15 Sep 1998 XXX@imap3.asu.edu wrote:

> Prof. Van, > I believe the source of my, as well as my classmates' frustrations is the > ambiguity of our objectives. My main question is "Why?" are we doing the > things that we do?

You need to be specific about what "things"

Why are we working in groups if we write it all > personally?

Because working in groups gives you a chance to work in teams as is the emerging trend in business and academia. Collaboration is important when developing a community of writers whose aims are similar.

Why did we look up sources for others when we don't get a copy of them?

Hope we solved this in class today.

> My other concern with the class is that I don't feel that you've taught us > anything. You just say, ok, do it.

Scholarship on education clearly support a social epistemic, process approach to writing. This is where a group of writers learn about writing by writing. You learn by doing.

We are all at a loss for what it is we are supposed to do. That is why we are all so frustrated.

Do the homework. If you do it, study it, you will understand how it applies. Do the in-class exercises which are all directly related to writing your paper. Do the research and have the drafts ready on time.

> I've taken three English composition courses at Washington University in St. Louis (a much better school than this, if i may say) and i have never been a part of this type of class. It's not the computer that's different, it's the instruction.

Lots of teachers thought and planning has been applied to designing this course. Every detail of this course has been debated,discussed, and studied with the aim of improving student learning and writing. The composition board feel that this course will best prepare students for civic and academic writing. And it has had good results. Student's generally like the book, but wish they didn't have to do the homework . . .

It will help if you can develop some faith that we know what we're doing. Classes often feel confused in the beginning of the term. My methods are probably different than other teacher's methods . . . I hope so. I have taught this class regularly and sucessfully for eight years. The reason I request to teach it is is the satisfaction student's have on completing the course. They produce a piece of scholarship they are proud of, dramatically improve their analytic and writing skills,and usually learn quite a lot about them selves . . . the way they think, and the way they learn.

> Despite what you may think, i am on your side just as you are on ours.

Thanks, I believe you. I wouldn't be spending the time replying if I did not understand that your motives are benevolent.

I believe if you clearly lay out our objectives, why we do the things we do, that the class will come around and work with you instead of against you. We could all learn from this experience. We are actually here to learn. Without instruction, we feel that we are paying for nothing. Another cause of our frustration is the "busy work."

I don't know if you look at the exercises but they tell us to "reflect, underline, or think about" > things.

I know them intimately . . . I've been using this book for several years.

That's fine but somehow you expect us to put that on paper and turn in our thoughts. That is something that, as a professor, you should know we can't do.

This is something that as your instructor, I am helping you to do--because I know you can. It comes with lots of practice writing and thinking, something that this class is designed to foster.

> I thank you for your patience with us and for listening to my frustrations. > I'm sure we can figure this whole mess out if we give it a try.

I prefer to think of it as a stimulating problem to be solved! :) Compliments to you on your use of ethos in this (email) composition.

Please let me know how I can help. I will post a brief message to class in further clarification of some issues you've mentioned. I hope this has answered your questions. Finally, the responsibility for your learning is always your own.

for now, jvan

XXX

Date: Thu, 17 Sep 1998 12:06:30 -0700 (MST) From: XXX@imap3.asu.edu To: jvan@asu.edu Subject: Re: ENG 102 TTh 12:15

Thank you for addressing my issues. It is this kind of clarity i believe the class needs as well. I also believe much of the opposition you receive from us is just because we want to rile you up. This is only my own observation of course. Many students do not understand these issues as you have explained them to me. But i do appreciate you taking the time to address each of my concerns. I feel much better know. We'll see what we can do about bringing the class up to speed. Thanks for listening.

Date: Thu, 17 Sep 1998 12:08:49 -0700 (MST) From: XX@imap3.asu.edu To: jvan@asu.edu Subject: Re: CLASS OVERVIEW

Although, this class persuasion could be harder than i originally anticipated.:-)

Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 13:17:59 -0700 (MST) From: xx@imap3.asu.edu To: jvan@asu.edu Cc: xx@imap3.asu.edu Subject: Re: More on the Evaluation assignment

I am writing to you in response to what I been feeling and the general aura of the class. I relize that there is going to be a certain amount of work that is associated with a college leval english class. But I also think that there is a differece between quantity and quality. I feel that the majority of the work that we have done in here has had to do more with the quantity end of the spectrum. I have taken 3 years including a 300 leval compostition class. I have never been more confused about what is going on in any class. I relize that you do want us to learn the material on our own but there comes a point when we spend more time trying to figure out what the assignment is than actually working on it. I also relize that no matter how much english that you have, there is always more. In this class I feel that I am not learning anything. It seems that you just assign the work then say "ok go to it", I am not improving on the base that i already have I am just using it. I think it would do everybody in the class much more benifit if we were to accually go over the stuff in class. Also concerning the papers, I still think and know that I am still pretty confused over what you want in the paper. The other issue that the class, at least what i have heard from other people is that the other homework besides the main papers are a waste of time. We don't go over them we don't even talk about them. It would seem to me that if we are going to invest the time to do the homework then we should deserve a little more than a line of response when we get it back. If there is not class time to go over then maybe it should not be assigned. In other classes that i have taken we had no other homework but more was expected on the main papers. I would much rather work on one project than a bunch of "busy work". i am not trying to come across negative I don't hate the class. I am just a little bit frustrated. I would love to try, but it seems like the morei do, the farther away from the guidlines, that are fuzzy, I get.

thank you for the time. xx12;15 tth

I answered xx's query in class the next day. We discussed his paper and I further explained how the project's tied together and gave examples from this specific topic: urban land use planning, specifically around airports.

Date:

Sun, 13 Sep 1998 17:37:32 -0400 (EDT)From: Mc@AOL.COM

To: jvan@asu.edu Subject: Re: More on the Evaluation assignment (fwd)

I received your message, thank you. My essay is coming along great, the exercise we did in class on thursday is really helping.

-Mc.

Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 11:58:39 -0700 (MST) (12:15 class)

From: xx@imap3.asu.edu To: jvan@asu.edu Subject: Re: your mail

I am confused about the assignment. What did we do in class on thursday, was that not the evauluation assignment? If not what are we supposed o make 3-4 pages out of, I understand the assignment but I have a hard time thinking that it is four pages worth of writing.